[Sephrioth-Ansem leader]

So I was waiting awhile to ask about this, looking at the development of the crystal tools engine through the years. Final Fantasy XIII looks absolutely stunning, and now that we are coming closer to Final Fantasy VS XIII being released (from the looks of it at least) We are getting more and more peeks at how graphics are looking, and I literally after watching the VS XIII trailer had my jaw dropped at the opening scene with Noctis in the Car, it looked like well real life. Square obviously has an obsession with graphics and money to spare, it's evident even in earlier titles, while now we look at games like KHII and stuff like oh that's eh graphics, I've played it on my PS3 thousands of times and compared with other PS2 games on the console KH and FF games always looked crystal clear, they had their ps2 graphics but they appeared clear and sharp, while other games were almost always really blurry.

I've heard people's positions on the matter and other people believe that KH3 should be the same graphics as the rest of the games have been except for the sharpness added, and I'm just wondering- WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU DO THAT IF YOU HAVE SEEN THE STUNNING POWER THAT IS CT?!!?!?!?!??!? I've heard things like Disney characters look awkward, Disney touch would be lost, KH isn't FF quality.

Looking at the CGI cutscenes in KH and KHII how can anyone not want that while playing the game? Graphics have gotten a little better since 2005 and now we can get graphics like that for all the gameplay (to an extent obviously not as smoothly and large, but in a FF XIII style) and for the actual CGI cutscenes the feel would be like in a Pixar movie. Actually playing the whole game would be like playing a large Pixar movie, no Disney magic lost, but even added, characters would look more clarified, the settings would be larger more grander and really shine with all the little details Nomura likes to add. KHIII can really be a huge and stunning installment, why would you want to give that up for what your used to? I'm 100% sure many people thought the original KH would look horrible with 3d characters, look it ended up looking great, so you have the hardware why not use it to make everything really shine?

I also don't think it would necessarily be all photorealistic, but also not so much like the cartoony cgi, the story would most likely be darker and serious so I can imagine it would be more like in Deep Dive secret ending, more defined facial features, pores, and non greasy hair, while keeping some of the cartoony vibe but in a more Pixar esque way. Or a lighter version of VS XIII, I mean Nomura has stated that he want to take what he learns from CT and VS to the hypothetical KHIII and why wouldn't he? With all the years it's taken to get VS out and with how it's looking, Nomura has really been trying to push CT to it's limits, and with VS' development it's also really safe to assume that he would use all of that experience he gained from that to develop how KHIII would look like.

So sorry for my rant, I obviously think that CT should really be used and that KHIII should push CT to the limits it has at the moment and make it like a Pixar movie and make it the perfect mix of realism and hints of cartoonism, I don't think that Disney characters would look awkward but on the contrary would shine more, and I really don't understand why people would want to keep traditional graphics? for nostalgia? move on already.....

but I'd really like to hear what you all think about how graphics should or most likely would look like in KHIII!

[Vaerli]

I'm pretty sure Noctis in the car is pre-rendered. It doesn't get into gameplay/actual graphics until once the part where it starts moving around in the city.

You seem mistaken as to what the CT actual in game is compared to the high quality pre-rendered games are.

Sometimes pretties can interfere with other parts of the game. I find that as companies focus more and more on graphics, they neglect the feel and balance of gameplay, the overall plot, and character development.

While Crystal tools are pretty good, they're not quite as great as you make them out to be, as they also take more time to get such detail in the game, which extends release dates, and increases development costs, which no one is a fan of.

[Sephrioth-Ansem leader]

That car scene IS prerendered I thought I mentioned that before, there's also one more in the end of the extended trailer, one or two I forgot.... The stunning part is when they blended CGI pre rendered with the actual in game scenes like in FF13, dang you can tell which is which most of the time due to the lighting and small little details but they mask it so with transitons and angles........ thinking of that makes me want VS SO MUCH!!!!!!!! sorry...... fanboy lol

I don't actually think Square has this problem with graphics taking away from the actual game, the only examples I can even think of would be FFXIII's linearity, which seems to be more ofa type of production decision than a graphical decision since the whole game is a hallway, cutscene,prerenderedcutscene,cutscene,bossfight,hallway rinse and repeat until gran pulse where it takes a little change of linearity. And any other examples would probably to be very honest KH II, which had too much emphasis on the graphics and battle system and story elements, but actual gameplay was too easy, things felt rushed at parts and things were stale in some other parts.

I really don't think time would be as an issue, when you see that all the games for this generation from Square have taken so damn long to make getting used to the engine and developing new things, KH wouldn't be that different, yeah there would be some delays and everything if they wanted the game to look good and balanced but because they are so familiar with the engine and their past works on VS and by this point probably have the plot thought or the basic scenarios thought out (atleast nomura should have an idea by now if he's been working on all the handhelds for the series leading up to III) , with their experience I think they can learn mistakes from things like KHII's ease KH's controls and cameras FFXIII's linearity and lack of real exploration, and combine that with mistakes from VS that they might have, and then they can take good things like BBS' battle system in combination with other systems or learn from VS' scenarios or even XIII's paradigms, and take the beauty of the CTto really enhance the story (like time and day and active scenarios are in VS) but not replace the story. Nomura isn't really one to lack on story telling...


........ on something that caught my attention from your post

but going with character development, I think this is actually the real issue the games actually need at this point, WAY MORE THAN A GRAPHICS OVERHAUL, I won't go into it that much since it isn't that relevant to the topic i guess, but you brought up a good point, at this point I feel like the characters aren't really there yet, in BBS the TAV really feels like the had more development than characters like Kairi, or even Sora, it's not fair that we get almost no development on the characters Thats a thing that not III but DDD should start working on.

[sakuchan]

I'm a fan for KHIII gameplay parts to look like the cgi cutscenes of KHII. That would be so ballin'. Having to put it on the PS3, it's hard to imagine that we'd get anything less than that. The characters would look beautiful, but not photorealistic (like how FFs look when done in cgi). Donald, Goofy and Mickey would look right at home, like SAL said, straight out of a Pixar movie. More details than ever can be put into the settings (I've always thought that all KHs lacked, graphically, in the settings department, so I advocate putting more work there, but not so much work that it'll look like FFXIII, which drowned my senses and actually took away from the experience).

[Sephrioth-Ansem leader]

Saku do you mean the settings in like where things take place? or settings like the menus? Because I lol I feel like the menus in FFXIII are a bit too much clutter especially on crystanarium points, I get confused while switching off, just being a tad picky but it could be more picked together like the rest of the game.


With settings for things taking place, KH always has a sorta hallow feel to it in some areas, I find this especially in BBS for some reasons, While it shouldn't be cluttered and over the top I think they could work with the settings of the game and have open areas maybe like the ones we've seen like gran pulse or the ones that appear in VS XIII, huge but full of things to do and different routes to maybe expand exploration in the game have worlds instead of small rooms over small rooms more larger rooms with more areas to explore but keeping the different rooms over rooms just expanded, plus it would add to more things you could do for side quests, more heartless, and more prettyness lmao.. I don't think the FFXIII effect of drowning your senses would happen in a game like this if handled correctly with the camera controls, room sizes, and the battle system.

and when you mentioned settings i wondered if you meant menus also .................. which I mentioned menus in FFXIII idk something seemed cluttered all the sparkles and effects and things all over, I think it helps out on KH that the colors are typically darker and menus are bolder and larger and not as all over the place, I can imagine how stunning an HD application of it would look like, I think some guy made some vids of it before showing his concept, it works well. I wonder also about the interface, would it be traditional sorta modern KH I menus that we've seen with the entire KH series, or the stylized KHII menus, or would we see something like and HUD that disappears and appears when prompted to allow more visual senses to be added. It might also be interesting if they moved with a flexible HUD or one that appears or disappears or fades off... I really like how the KHII eye candy appeal is like with the HUD as apposed to the other titles which feel, slightly more reduced to make space for the screen, but in the case of how KHIII would look like I think things like the menu animations would be a welcome return, or having like in VS character animations on their profiles showing what they are doing, even a slightly smaller HUD just to show more of the image and less of the info, but not too small as too completely make it hard to read. Disappearing HUD seems like it would be just idk a fantasy of mine that probably won't happen, and I could care less if it did or not, really with the HUD I could care less about how they changed it or if they even decided to change it, as long as it works and isn't distracting or feels too low tech to be on par wit the game, if that makes sense.

[sakuchan]

I meant settings as in background imagery and places of exploration. KH environments are pretty sparse, more noticeable in BbS but equally noticeable in KHII. In fact, I think the best work in the environment was done in KHI, but that might be because the type of worlds allowed more appealing "architecture" eg. Wonderland, Monstro, Tarzan's world; compared to KHII, where we had Pride Lands (ugh) and I insist that Land of Dragons could have looked more appealing but looked dry instead. To appeal to an audience 15+, they need to come up with more immersive environments that are prettier and doesn't leave so much to the imagination. That's one of the reasons why I advocate a dramatic upgrade in KH graphics, because they'll lose me if I don't see it. If KHIII is being committed for the PS3, there's no excuse to keep the exact same style as the PS2 and PSP titles. They could do SO MUCH MORE.

In terms of menus, I like the way it looks now because it's easy to navigate and feels intuitive, like using a PC. FFXIII's menu is prettier and more sophisticated than any I've seen for a game, but it's perhaps needlessly pretty. It's overwhelming to the senses, even though it's still quite functional. Unless KH adds another layer of depth into how we customize our skills and stats (eg. adds a Paradigm system), I don't see the need for increased stylization. Just keep it simple.

[Sephrioth-Ansem leader]

lmao saku, you took the words out of my mind, that's what I thought exactly! lol